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Dear ck.kislay,
You are subscribed to the thread "Real Estate Bubble Set to Burst Again in India" by MANOJa, there have been 13 post(s) to this thread, the last poster was raabta.
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
These following posts were made to the thread:
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: rohit_warren
On: July 15 2017 06:13 AM
[url]http://www.hindustantimes.com/pune-news/job-insecurity-drives-techie-to-suicide-in-pune/story-7p1ZwoRb5XtrUCreZVe1kN.html[/url] [h=1]In IT there is no job security': 25-year-old techie commits suicide in Pune[/h] Panic has started - I remember similar situation happened in US just before sub prime crisis when a banker committed suicide - Is something bigger is coming in IT sector of India Yesterday Infy reported that their q1 net job addition was negative 1800 which means they laid off 1800 more than they hired
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: iceemani
On: July 15 2017 07:37 AM
[QUOTE=rohit_warren;n2534336][url]http://www.hindustantimes.com/pune-news/job-insecurity-drives-techie-to-suicide-in-pune/story-7p1ZwoRb5XtrUCreZVe1kN.html[/url] [h=1]In IT there is no job security': 25-year-old techie commits suicide in Pune[/h] Panic has started - I remember similar situation happened in US just before sub prime crisis when a banker committed suicide - Is something bigger is coming in IT sector of India Yesterday Infy reported that their q1 net job addition was negative 1800 which means they laid off 1800 more than they hired [/QUOTE] Yes you quit IT for finance, but why so much hate for IT. Even coal mines which were declared dead still employ people. IT is not dead, it is just moving to next phase of its efficiency. I would dare to say it is still in the beginning stage of its super cycle. big data will make all the conventional business more efficient and IOT is going to ease human life a lot. people over the time will get efficient if their jobs are gone, one job loss is not end of life.
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: rohit_warren
On: July 15 2017 07:49 AM
[QUOTE=iceemani;n2534370] Yes you quit IT for finance, but why so much hate for IT. Even coal mines which were declared dead still employ people. IT is not dead, it is just moving to next phase of its efficiency. I would dare to say it is still in the beginning stage of its super cycle. big data will make all the conventional business more efficient and IOT is going to ease human life a lot. people over the time will get efficient if their jobs are gone, one job loss is not end of life. [/QUOTE] You got one part right the part which is incorrect is that I hate IT - actually my life is interwind with IT the point I want to make is that the hype around IT is overdone and should be moderated
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: southsea
On: July 15 2017 09:10 AM
[url]http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-13/goldman-had-600-cash-equity-traders-2000-it-now-has-2[/url] Finance is going to see a bigger change than IT. Engineers will still be required to build stuff. Fewer and fewer will be required to trade stocks. The key line is - "Automated trading programs have taken over the rest of the work, supported by 200 computer engineers" People are better off being in IT than in finance.
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: iceemani
On: July 15 2017 09:18 AM
[QUOTE=rohit_warren;n2534371] You got one part right the part which is incorrect is that I hate IT - actually my life is interwind with IT the point I want to make is that the hype around IT is overdone and should be moderated [/QUOTE] Yes you do, probably you don't realize you are biased. For that matter not just your life, everyone's life is interwind with IT, it will only get more stronger.
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: Magadh_Pride
On: July 15 2017 10:29 AM
[QUOTE=iceemani;n2534370] .. IT is not dead, it is just moving to next phase of its efficiency. I would dare to say it is still in the beginning stage of its super cycle. big data will make all the conventional business more efficient and IOT is going to ease human life a lot...... [/QUOTE] It's not a question of IT under stress. It's a question of what is Indian companies plan to uplift and redefine their current business model which is based on pure cost arbitrage for low end jobs like maintenance and testing kind of jobs.
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: iceemani
On: July 15 2017 10:53 AM
[QUOTE=Magadh_Pride;n2534403] It's not a question of IT under stress. It's a question of what is Indian companies plan to uplift and redefine their current business model which is based on pure cost arbitrage for low end jobs like maintenance and testing kind of jobs. [/QUOTE] exactly. This is what I meant. The job losses are there, but is just clouding the direction where the industry is headed. atleast Infy is clear on the strategy, they in fact predicted the slowdown in the service market and started positioning themselves for it long ago.They brought Sikka on board based on the strategy. He very much understands the changing market, he openly stated he doesn't fear for trump or demonetization but for AI that's going to make service jobs redundant. Mana once gains steam, will give a tough stage for Watson. Just in case if you missed the news this morning, see who is on a driverless vehicle it's not Elon Musk. [url]http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/vishal-sikka-arrives-in-driverless-cart-offers-glimpse-into-infosys-new-plans-1724627?site=full[/url]
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: rohit_warren
On: July 15 2017 12:34 PM
[QUOTE=southsea;n2534385][url]http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-13/goldman-had-600-cash-equity-traders-2000-it-now-has-2[/url] Finance is going to see a bigger change than IT. Engineers will still be required to build stuff. Fewer and fewer will be required to trade stocks. The key line is - "Automated trading programs have taken over the rest of the work, supported by 200 computer engineers" People are better off being in IT than in finance. [/QUOTE] YOu know what - we at finance have been using IT since days it was not even called IT - We love automated systems - At finance we have understood long ago that humans make mistakes so most of the trading has been automated long ago. Those who have read my very old posts know that I have often referred to "system" which is a simple software using some algo for buy and sell decisions. Financial matters are like surgical procedures where despite all tools available the intervention of the surgeon is required - same in finance industry - the client willing to risk his savings wants to talk to someone live not a machine. This may change in coming 20 years or so - read my presentation India 2035 written almost 10 years ago check that on slide share . com jo likha hai wo hoga - IT industry is changing and the fat pay packages are going away - IT has become more of a clerical job now and the salaries will too .
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: flatowner2
On: July 15 2017 01:31 PM
10 Yrs back fresher salary in IT company was Rs 3L and now fresher is paying Rs 3L to get the Job. this tells the story of indian IT comp.
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: flatowner2
On: July 15 2017 01:34 PM
Post from Social Media:. [B]The Great Indian Banking Scam[/B]: I want to bring attention to a disturbing nationwide organized scam that you are a familiar with, but most don't quite understand the "fraud" part of it . And like some of my answers do, it may ruffle some feathers. But truth must be told. Here it is: Go to the outskirts of any major city in india, you see miles & miles of semi built structures that just stay dead still & never get completed. All these buildings started in different years, but surprisingly, they all face "financial trouble" just after the basic structure is built. Why don't we see buildings that stop in-between…..say after 4 floor or 8 floors ? The answer is an organised scam played by the state governments, builders, banks & accounting bodies. This is how it works. The builders sell you construction linked plan. You assume that its a fair plan as the builder will charge money as & when the construction progresses & it is in builder's interest to complete the project with speed. Looks fair for all ………. This is where the catch is !!! The so called "construction linked plan" is a sham designed by the agencies listed above, backed fully by the govt & banks. Lets look at the reasons: What is the scam here ? : The payment plan is designed in a way that you have to pay 90% of the price of flat "at the laying of the top floor of the building". By this time the builder has spend only 50% of the project cost. Most of the money is needed later in finishing work, electrical wiring, pluming, flooring, paints, lifts, external work, parking, basements,govt permissions for water,sewage, power, etc. You get the logic here. Now the builder is sitting on neat 40% profit (90% - 50%) & all that he is left to "earn" from you is 10%. Why would he spend another 30% money just to recover 10% from you? He stops work right here !!! You're thinking — he should not because there is a timeline to deliver the project ……………but wait. What if he misses the deadline of delivery? There must be some penalty ? Check the agreement…….ah…. well……Keep searching !! So if developer delays the project, there is no penalty due on his part (or at best its princely sum of Rs 5 per sq feet per month…. which comes to a meager 1% interest !!! ). But if you delay his payment, interest charged is 12% to 18%. Ever heard of one sided agreements ? Which business would not seize this opportunity to "borrow" free money without interest ? Why did the banks & RBI supported it ? : The befitting supporting actor award here goes to the banks & RBI. They lend "you" the money on "your" credit report. Banks don't finance the builders for land purchase. They are also very shy on financing the builders for construction(rates are more than 15% to 18%). But wait, consumers can always borrow at 10% & "pay" the builder. So essentially, the consumer is "financing the builder" in the name of "purchasing the apartment". Oh, did i tell you the best part ……… this money is without any interest for the builder as we see above. So a developer to whom no bank lends money below 18% & that too is seen very risky, can "get easy finance from the same banks" at 0% interest rate, all in the name of consumers!!! While RBI could have set this right just by changing the construction linked payment schedule thru banks, it chose to sit with eyes shut, while the banks & builders continue to fleece customers. Where did the money go ? : Well, democracy is an expensive way to run governments, specially in developing countries. Every state govt has been enjoying the party with builders & this was a "legal" way to pull huge credit money from the banking system on the books of the "reasonably wealthy middle class" who was sold the idea of buying a house as it "appreciates forever" with tax breaks. Builders diverted money to the political parties to get further favors on land & permits. Secondly, the builder has used this surplus 40% "profits" to buy new land parcels so as to launch more projects & collect even more surplus interest free money. The land prices were assumed to be appreciating forever as more & more money was being pumped out of the banks. The music had to stop some day. What about the consumers? : The "middle class" consumer will continue to pay his monthly installment to banks, while their money has been siphoned off by the builders, political parties, govt officials & the banks. The apartment that was sold as 40 lacs will eventually cost 60 to 70 lacs considering the delayed possession, not to mention some cases where money is lost forever. You dare not default since you are just a retail consumer. Don't dare to become an industrialist who can default & live happily ever after. State governments are all hands in, trying to keep existing projects out of RERA. Even if these are included, try fighting the legal battle to get decision from regulator first. Then move to Appellate Tribunal (yes, this comes before the High court) , then high court & finally supreme court. Can u hold till 20 years or rather take the apartment on builder's terms whenever he feels like offering the same to you ? Talk of organized banking loot by the government, this is it. If it feels like your story also, your are not alone. But pls never assume that property prices don't fall. Staying on rent is not that bad. And don't you ever buy into the hype .
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: polo1234
On: July 15 2017 02:06 PM
[QUOTE=flatowner2;n2534443]Post from Social Media:. [B]The Great Indian Banking Scam[/B]: I want to bring attention to a disturbing nationwide organized scam that you are a familiar with, but most don't quite understand the "fraud" part of it . And like some of my answers do, it may ruffle some feathers. But truth must be told. Here it is: Go to the outskirts of any major city in india, you see miles & miles of semi built structures that just stay dead still & never get completed. All these buildings started in different years, but surprisingly, they all face "financial trouble" just after the basic structure is built. Why don't we see buildings that stop in-between…..say after 4 floor or 8 floors ? The answer is an organised scam played by the state governments, builders, banks & accounting bodies. This is how it works. The builders sell you construction linked plan. You assume that its a fair plan as the builder will charge money as & when the construction progresses & it is in builder's interest to complete the project with speed. Looks fair for all ………. This is where the catch is !!! The so called "construction linked plan" is a sham designed by the agencies listed above, backed fully by the govt & banks. Lets look at the reasons: What is the scam here ? : The payment plan is designed in a way that you have to pay 90% of the price of flat "at the laying of the top floor of the building". By this time the builder has spend only 50% of the project cost. Most of the money is needed later in finishing work, electrical wiring, pluming, flooring, paints, lifts, external work, parking, basements,govt permissions for water,sewage, power, etc. You get the logic here. Now the builder is sitting on neat 40% profit (90% - 50%) & all that he is left to "earn" from you is 10%. Why would he spend another 30% money just to recover 10% from you? He stops work right here !!! You're thinking — he should not because there is a timeline to deliver the project ……………but wait. What if he misses the deadline of delivery? There must be some penalty ? Check the agreement…….ah…. well……Keep searching !! So if developer delays the project, there is no penalty due on his part (or at best its princely sum of Rs 5 per sq feet per month…. which comes to a meager 1% interest !!! ). But if you delay his payment, interest charged is 12% to 18%. Ever heard of one sided agreements ? Which business would not seize this opportunity to "borrow" free money without interest ? Why did the banks & RBI supported it ? : The befitting supporting actor award here goes to the banks & RBI. They lend "you" the money on "your" credit report. Banks don't finance the builders for land purchase. They are also very shy on financing the builders for construction(rates are more than 15% to 18%). But wait, consumers can always borrow at 10% & "pay" the builder. So essentially, the consumer is "financing the builder" in the name of "purchasing the apartment". Oh, did i tell you the best part ……… this money is without any interest for the builder as we see above. So a developer to whom no bank lends money below 18% & that too is seen very risky, can "get easy finance from the same banks" at 0% interest rate, all in the name of consumers!!! While RBI could have set this right just by changing the construction linked payment schedule thru banks, it chose to sit with eyes shut, while the banks & builders continue to fleece customers. Where did the money go ? : Well, democracy is an expensive way to run governments, specially in developing countries. Every state govt has been enjoying the party with builders & this was a "legal" way to pull huge credit money from the banking system on the books of the "reasonably wealthy middle class" who was sold the idea of buying a house as it "appreciates forever" with tax breaks. Builders diverted money to the political parties to get further favors on land & permits. Secondly, the builder has used this surplus 40% "profits" to buy new land parcels so as to launch more projects & collect even more surplus interest free money. The land prices were assumed to be appreciating forever as more & more money was being pumped out of the banks. The music had to stop some day. What about the consumers? : The "middle class" consumer will continue to pay his monthly installment to banks, while their money has been siphoned off by the builders, political parties, govt officials & the banks. The apartment that was sold as 40 lacs will eventually cost 60 to 70 lacs considering the delayed possession, not to mention some cases where money is lost forever. You dare not default since you are just a retail consumer. Don't dare to become an industrialist who can default & live happily ever after. State governments are all hands in, trying to keep existing projects out of RERA. Even if these are included, try fighting the legal battle to get decision from regulator first. Then move to Appellate Tribunal (yes, this comes before the High court) , then high court & finally supreme court. Can u hold till 20 years or rather take the apartment on builder's terms whenever he feels like offering the same to you ? Talk of organized banking loot by the government, this is it. If it feels like your story also, your are not alone. But pls never assume that property prices don't fall. Staying on rent is not that bad. And don't you ever buy into the hype . [/QUOTE] All of this goes away if you buy RTM Frankly people need to realise that buying under construction property means that you are becoming part of the financial and operational risk of the builder. Also that giving money to builder without getting the apartment immediately means you are also taking the credit risk . Subvention scheme are the worst. It's clearly a mechanism of transferring the credit risk from bank to home buyer.Builder has absolutely no incentive in completing the project in subvention scheme .. he has already got your money
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: southsea
On: July 16 2017 01:54 AM
[QUOTE=rohit_warren;n2534429] YOu know what - we at finance have been using IT since days it was not even called IT - We love automated systems - At finance we have understood long ago that humans make mistakes so most of the trading has been automated long ago. Those who have read my very old posts know that I have often referred to "system" which is a simple software using some algo for buy and sell decisions. Financial matters are like surgical procedures where despite all tools available the intervention of the surgeon is required - same in finance industry - the client willing to risk his savings wants to talk to someone live not a machine. [/QUOTE] That 'someone live' will be a sales guy. No different from what is happening in the banks today. Everytime you enter a bank you are pushed towards the latest 'guaranteed return' ULIP or something like that. The days of folks sitting and opening accounts, handing out cheques, DDs, etc are coming to an end. Same goes for trading. It will be done but the guys doing it will be programmers. You will still need people to manage relationships with clients. But that is a different skill set from trading.
With warm regards,
Team IREF
https://www.indianrealestateforum.com/forum/city-forums/ncr-real-estate/gurgaon-real-estate/13876-real-estate-bubble-set-to-burst-again-in-india
Posted by: raabta
On: July 16 2017 02:15 AM
[QUOTE=rohit_warren;n2534429] YOu know what - we at finance have been using IT since days it was not even called IT - We love automated systems - At finance we have understood long ago that humans make mistakes so most of the trading has been automated long ago. Those who have read my very old posts know that I have often referred to "system" which is a simple software using some algo for buy and sell decisions. Financial matters are like surgical procedures where despite all tools available the intervention of the surgeon is required - same in finance industry - the client willing to risk his savings wants to talk to someone live not a machine. This may change in coming 20 years or so - read my presentation India 2035 written almost 10 years ago check that on slide share . com jo likha hai wo hoga - IT industry is changing and the fat pay packages are going away - IT has become more of a clerical job now and the salaries will too .[/QUOTE] Speak for yourself. People who are good at what they do survive. It is the poser which gets the boot. There is tremendous amount of work to be done...although the tools have changed. For some one who claims to be far sighted..howcome u ended up investing in faridabad of all places...?
With warm regards,
Team IREF
With warm regards,
Team IREF
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